THE Hoover Forum - Your Opinion, Please

HSCIN Ex Member	Re: Your Opinion, Please Reply #20 - 07/02/08 at 9:06am Thank you for your votes. Thank you for your opinion. At first blush, it appears that folks might just be more scared of the devil they don't know than the devil they do..... Sorry, that's just my opinion.
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GoHoover2008 Hoover Forum Sophomore THE Hoover Forum Posts: 59	Re: Your Opinion, Please Reply #21 - 07/02/08 at 12:47pm What do you mean by scared?
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HSCIN

Ex Member

Re: Your Opinion, Please
Reply #22 - 07/03/08 at 10:39am

It's an old saying.

What I mean is that moving to an elected Board is scary for a lot of folks (at least the ones that voted in this poll....). We know what we're getting with an appointed Board.

The scare tactics of "the AEA will control an elected Board", "what good folks will put themselves up for an election", etc., etc., etc. appear to have a serious influence in this state. 90% of school boards across the country are elected. But not in Alabama.

Is there a better word than "scared"?

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GoHoover2008

Hoover Forum Sophomore

THE Hoover Forum

Posts: 59

Re: Your Opinion, Please
Reply #23 - 07/03/08 at 11:03am

Using the word scared makes it sound like 60% of the folks that participated in the poll are afraid to do the what they think is right. A better choice would be preferred. Sounds to me like the results of the poll went against your opinion, so you attempted to rationalize the reason that the results are the way they are and present them as being skewed due to fear of the unknown. Every newly appointed or elected member is an unknown commodity.

Just my opinion

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HSCIN

Ex Member

Re: Your Opinion, Please
Reply #24 - 07/03/08 at 11:12am

Sorry, 2008, I didn't look at it that way. Perhaps you're correct. I take back the word scared. Even if it was part of the saying.... Wink

For the record, I don't have a preference. I'm concerned that either way is too political anymore. I believe we've reached a point in our school system's life cycle where politics and school happenings are inextricably intertwined. Heck, we started out as a politically-charged school system. I shouldn't be surprised that we find ourselves where we are. I just wish that folks would be appointed to the Board based on their character, not their agenda.

I went before this Council in January 2006 with a packet of information (no, I never go anywhere without handouts) as to how to select a good school board member. I gave them each a copy of that information and asked them to please consider carefully their choices for school board members. They appointed Bolt and Baker that year.

Having said that, I will say that I believe that Mr. Cooper possesses the highest character imaginable. His prior work has shown that he is interested in the welfare of ALL of the children in Hoover City Schools, not just his or his friends' children.

Thanks for asking the question, 2008.

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HSCIN

Ex Member

Re: Your Opinion, Please
Reply #25 - 07/03/08 at 11:46am

Quote from GoHoover2008 on 07/03/08 at 11:03am:

Sounds to me like the results of the poll went against your opinion, so you attempted to rationalize the reason that the results are the way they are and present them as being skewed due to fear of the unknown.

And, 2008, some friendly advice: be careful when making assumptions. You're wrong about this one. These results didn't go "against" my opinion and I never "attempt...to rationalize". Facts. I deal in facts. And sayings.

Have a nice day. Glad to have you in the discussion.

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HSCIN

Ex Member

Re: Your Opinion, Please
Reply #26 - 07/03/08 at 12:03pm

Quote from HSCIN on 07/03/08 at 10:39am:

It's an old saying.

I made a mistake. Here's the real saying and its definition from UsingEnglish.com:

Better the devil you know. This is the shortened form of the full idiom, 'better the devil you know than the devil you don't', and means that it is often better to deal with someone or something you are familiar with and know, even if they are not ideal, than take a risk with an unknown person or thing.

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voiceofreason

Hoover Forum All-Star Member

THE Hoover Forum

Posts: 727

Re: Your Opinion, Please
Reply #27 - 07/03/08 at 12:39pm

Political postions are, by their very nature, political -- whether they're appointed or elected. In my opinion, the only possible advantage to an elected school board is that they would be more directly responsible to the electorate, but the electorate (those who actually vote) and those who choose to run for election are swayed by political forces and personal agendas themselves. As has been often demonstrated with other political offices, the electorate is just as likely to elect someone who turns out to be unqualified, incompetent or unethical as an elected official is to appoint someone unqualified, incompetent or unethical. And, by the same token, a highly-qualified, very competent, and morally ethical person can also be either elected or appointed. (And I believe the electorate did indirectly influence the appointment of such a board member with the most recent appointment.) So going through the time-consuming and convoluted process of changing permanently to an elected school board hardly seems worth the effort. That's why I voted to keep the current appointed system, despite its flaws -- not because I'm scared of the unknown, but because I really don't think it matters. What matters is having a strong school administration and an involved community force in place to serve as a check and balance system for the school board and to keep the focus on improving achievement for all students.

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Disillusioned Hoover Forum Freshman THE Hoover Forum Posts: 35	Re: Your Opinion, Please Reply #28 - 07/03/08 at 1:07pm voice, yours is the best post i've read on here in quite some time.
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HSCIN

Ex Member

Re: Your Opinion, Please
Reply #29 - 07/03/08 at 2:02pm

Quote from voiceofreason on 07/03/08 at 12:39pm:

I really don't think it matters. What matters is having a strong school administration and an involved community force in place to serve as a check and balance system for the school board and to keep the focus on improving achievement for all students.

Agreed. [Emphasis added.]

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beeline

Hoover Forum Sophomore

THE Hoover Forum

Posts: 90

Re: Your Opinion, Please
Reply #30 - 07/03/08 at 7:40pm

I must say that I have lived in an area where the board was elected and it was the most ridiculous conglomeration of folks you've ever seen--a total mess of people who had no educational experience--seemingly as students or teachers! You can, in effect, elect your board by electing the right people who are in charge of appointing board members not by selling their appointment power, but by doing what is right. Voting is such a manner requires an informed electorate of folks who are not just interested in one particular demographic group's agenda, but who are interested in the general well being of the city. I can't believe that anyone thinks that our present board--minus EC--has helped the property value of Hoover residents. When it starts hitting citizens in the pocketbook, they may pay a little more attention to the world around them. Hopefully that will be the case with the upcoming muicipal election. Having a new senior center is a wonderful thing for a city to have--especially as I get older myself; however, unless we want to have an aging and dying city we must do things to attract young families as well. Adults with school age children are looking for the best school system they can afford. If Hoover cannot provide that, those families look elsewhere.

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aka_deplume

Hoover Forum All-Star Member

"Smug"

Posts: 1481

Re: Your Opinion, Please
Reply #31 - 07/03/08 at 9:15pm

Quote from beeline on 07/03/08 at 7:40pm:

I must say that I have lived in an area where the board was elected and it was the most ridiculous conglomeration of folks you've ever seen--a total mess of people who had no educational experience--seemingly as students or teachers! You can, in effect, elect your board by electing the right people who are in charge of appointing board members not by selling their appointment power, but by doing what is right. Voting is such a manner requires an informed electorate of folks who are not just interested in one particular demographic group's agenda, but who are interested in the general well being of the city. I can't believe that anyone thinks that our present board--minus EC--has helped the property value of Hoover residents. When it starts hitting citizens in the pocketbook, they may pay a little more attention to the world around them. Hopefully that will be the case with the upcoming muicipal election. Having a new senior center is a wonderful thing for a city to have--especially as I get older myself; however, unless we want to have an aging and dying city we must do things to attract young families as well. Adults with school age children are looking for the best school system they can afford. If Hoover cannot provide that, those families look elsewhere.

I wish there was a way to frame this post. It hits on some many points that are so spot on, from the very first sentence to the last. I would go as far as saying that this post should be required reading for everyone. Outstanding post, beeline!

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"If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles."
Sun Tsu, The Art of War

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GoHoover2008

Hoover Forum Sophomore

THE Hoover Forum

Posts: 59

Re: Your Opinion, Please
Reply #32 - 07/04/08 at 9:34am

Quote from HSCIN on 07/03/08 at 11:46am:

And, 2008, some friendly advice: be careful when making assumptions. You're wrong about this one. These results didn't go "against" my opinion and I never "attempt...to rationalize". Facts. I deal in facts. And sayings.

No need to get defensive. Your subject line and poll asked for my opinion and I gave it. The intention was not to come off as disrespectful, just in disagreement with what appeared to be your stance.

I also deal in facts and sayings. Henry Adams once said it best.

"Nothing in education is so astonishing as the amount of ignorance as it accumulates in the form of inert facts."

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Poll
Question: Do you believe the Hoover Board of Education should be:
* This poll has now closed *
Appointed 24 (61.5%) Elected 15 (38.4%) Total votes: 39 « Created by: HSCIN on: 06/10/08 at 9:09pm »